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Thread: We have just passed the carbon tipping point of 400 parts per million.....forever.

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lifee View Post
    global warming isnt d biggest threat 2 life, laws r it doesnt matter if we solve d climate change if ders no ppl 2 lawly b permitted 2 live on it.
    What about Natural Laws... hmmm Lifee

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ernest View Post
    basically Americans "deserve" what we are getting with him.
    Yep, pretty much. Although, we Americans deserve whatever President we get regardless. The System works exactly as it is intended, exactly as it is designed to do.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ernest View Post
    Only time will tell how things will play out but if things start looking like a Sci-fi Dystopian Film, maybe then more people will finally give up on the idea of having to be Led by someone.
    Well, keep in mind why people have to be led to begin with.

  3. #43
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    A long time ago, there were animals and plants. The earth was warmer.

    The animals and plants went into the ground and became coal and oil. The earth is cooler.

    If we release all of that carbon, why would the earth not go back to the warmer days of old? How is it not replicating the conditions of warmer days?

    I don't know much about this issue, just curious about the answer to that question.

  4. #44
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    Whether climate change is anthropogenic or not is only somewhat relevant. Our response to it must include the possibility the it is. The solution is to design more efficient ekistic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ekistics systems that are more efficient. If society were ordered as prescribed by the Venus Project we could actually achieve a carbon negative civilization. The clear and present danger we face makes the implementation of such a plan even more urgent.
    Ernest and HAL9000 like this.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by jody View Post
    Whether climate change is anthropogenic or not is only somewhat relevant. Our response to it must include the possibility the it is. The solution is to design more efficient ekistic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ekistics systems that are more efficient. If society were ordered as prescribed by the Venus Project we could actually achieve a carbon negative civilization. The clear and present danger we face makes the implementation of such a plan even more urgent.
    Some are arguing that the earth is entering a cooling phase leading up to the next ice age. What if we need all the carbon we can get?

    What if the sun is controlling the temperature of the earth? Anything we humans can do against the sun is like draining the ocean with a spoon.

    It's unfortunate that this issue is so political that we can't get a straight answer to our questions. It feels like the earth is warming to me personally and it also feels like there is absolutely nothing that can be done about it even if our carbon emissions are negative. But that's just my opinion.

    The problem is the politicalization of science which includes all fields of science such as medicine as well as climatology.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by SophicDrippins View Post
    The problem is the politicalization of science which includes all fields of science such as medicine as well as climatology.
    But isn't this a Better Safe Than Sorry situation?

    This concerns all Life on this Planet so shouldn't that take priority over Politics & Economics. Right now everything is backwards. We keep debating these issues and treating People/Planet like if they are immaterial & minor in all of this. Like Politics/Economics can exist without even Us and the Planet around?

  7. #47
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    > What if the sun is controlling the temperature of the earth? Anything we humans can do against the sun is like draining the ocean with a spoon.

    I remember reading that repeatedly for several decades, reminds me of:

    Beginning of glaciers and the next ice-age? Rapidly increasing permanent Scottish snow | Scottish Sceptic

    As such, being a tad near The Arctic Circle I've been doing the best I can to make sure the house is ready for more snow. (I plan to move my satellite dish up so it can hopefully clear the snowline..)

    Though I imagine the main issue will be affording the fuel costs to keep warm !


    Now, I wonder if I can earn enough money to build a solar farm.. (Equipped with windscreen wipers to keep the snow off !)

    And I really should build a snowplough to keep the roads free.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ernest View Post
    But isn't this a Better Safe Than Sorry situation?

    This concerns all Life on this Planet so shouldn't that take priority over Politics & Economics. Right now everything is backwards. We keep debating these issues and treating People/Planet like if they are immaterial & minor in all of this. Like Politics/Economics can exist without even Us and the Planet around?
    Of course! I agree and that's why I pointed out that the problem is political.... even among the scientists themselves. How do we stop people being political?

    The planet seems to have a bit of leeway in that we can stop carbon emissions now and turn things around, but what I'm more pissed about is the wool that was pulled over our eyes about cooking fats for the better-part of the 20th century and how many people died early because medical science itself was political and continues to be political with prescription drugs and each seemingly guaranteed a future class action lawsuit.

    By "political" I don't necessarily mean politics. Political defined is "relating to the ideas or strategies of a particular party or group in politics." Snip the "in politics" off and that's what I mean. Perhaps I mean "tribal". Suffice it to say that the right word surely isn't "scientific".

    They demonized saturated fat to peddle their polyunsaturated fats in their vegetable oils by finding conclusions that they were looking for in studies (which were questionable at best, both the conclusion and the quality of study). Then after people got wise that poly wasn't so great, they seized a golden opportunity to unload all that toxic rapeseed oil (ie canola) because it just happened to be high in monounsaturated fat while at the same time raping the public with their cholesterol lowering drugs.

    If they want to be political or tribal with astronomy, ok fine I guess... we can continue believing in dark matter because they say so, but with medicine and climate there should be some real scientists involved. We should be able to state with certainty if mankind is capable of altering the carbon balance with its activity, but because of this eternal feud of one side vs the other, most folks can't make the call.

    You say "better safe than sorry", but some prestigious people have said what contribution humanity could offer wouldn't amount to a hill of beans towards the inevitable cooling/heating that's coming. Consider the size of the sun. A million earths could fit inside of the sun. If that is true, we need to start working on a solution to that problem rather than quibbling about relatively meaningless carbon emissions.
    ____________________________________

    As an aside, I can tell you how mother nature operates: First, after a few hot and dry years, forest trees begin to suffer and fall prey to a beetle which thrives and kills nearly the whole forest. Then, a fire erupts which transforms all that carbon into gas (and that in response to the drought that preceded it). From the fire the ground is fertilized and new trees emerge. That process has been repeating for eons and somehow the earth hasn't gotten hotter, but rather, it's been on a long cooling trend since it was formed billions of years ago.

    So, we have a few drought years and our response is opposite of nature... ie reducing carbon. In nature, the heat always precedes the carbon emission as if the emission is the effect of the heat. What if the carbon emission is not just an effect, but a remedy? What if the earth is warming and we stop emitting the one thing that, somehow, cools it back down? Or what if the earth is nearing an ice age? It's a shame that we can't know for certain the things that are so important.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouTuber View Post
    > What if the sun is controlling the temperature of the earth? Anything we humans can do against the sun is like draining the ocean with a spoon.

    I remember reading that repeatedly for several decades, reminds me of:

    Beginning of glaciers and the next ice-age? Rapidly increasing permanent Scottish snow | Scottish Sceptic

    As such, being a tad near The Arctic Circle I've been doing the best I can to make sure the house is ready for more snow. (I plan to move my satellite dish up so it can hopefully clear the snowline..)

    Though I imagine the main issue will be affording the fuel costs to keep warm !


    Now, I wonder if I can earn enough money to build a solar farm.. (Equipped with windscreen wipers to keep the snow off !)

    And I really should build a snowplough to keep the roads free.
    Building stuff is fun

    They say one of the effects of global warming is that the north will get colder and I think that is because the ocean currents and jet stream will not bring the equatorial heat to north europe. https://insideclimatenews.org/news/3...Boston-US-Asia

    If that doesn't happen, then warmer weather could mean more snow: https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...arsher-winter/

    No matter what happens, you're getting snow lol

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